Legendz

Feel free to nod in agreement if you’ve heard this one before. Rapper on the brink of huge crossover finds his success stalled by the inevitable penitentiary sentence; in a shocking turn of events his subsequent prison stay not only creates more of a buzz for the hugely successful album but also generates street credibility upon said rappers release. While the above scenario sounds like the ultimate gangsta’s fairy tale, K-Solo, Slick Rick, and a host of A&R’s with lackluster album sales to show for their faith and financial investments in such outcomes will probably tell you differently.

Just ask Pimp C. After years of paying dues and influencing today’s generation of “Trap Stars,” UGK was poised to trade in their pockets full of stones for platinum plaques by milking the commercial success of their Jay-Z collaboration “Big Pimpin.’” While no one would doubt that the Port Arthur natives had seen their fair share of adversity, the lukewarm reception of 2001’s Dirty Money surely couldn’t have been part of the plan. Neither was Pimp C’s four year prison bid, stemming from missing community service following an aggravated-assault conviction. If that seemed unlikely, surely no one could predict that UGK would be one of the few groups to benefit from America’s penal system.

Aside from inadvertently creating two successful solo albums, the incarceration of “Sweet Jones” turned “Free Pimp C,” into a rallying cry for virtually every artist below the Mason-Dixon Line—the movement even came with matching t-shirts and hats. The man whom the government has been calling Chad Butler for the last four years has no aspirations on glorifying his prison experience. He’d much rather talk about his role as a “Slab Music” ambassador for fellow Texans such as Slim Thug, Paul Wall, Chamillionaire and Mike Jones. But, what else would you expect from “The Trill One"?

AllHipHop.com: When you first came home a lot of people wanted to interview you about being in prison. You originally stated that you would avoid doing media such as 20/20 and BET and just release a DVD, what’s the status of that?

Pimp C: We dropped the Pimpalation DVD and it talks about it a little bit. I don’t like to comment too much on it though because it’s nothing positive down there. You can turn that positive into a negative, but for the most part it’s negative. I prefer to talk about the music.

AllHipHop.com: That’s understandable, I can respect that.

Pimp C: I’m not saying that to you, like I don’t want you to ask me those [prison] questions. I’m telling you that that’s the reason I haven’t done any interviews on that level. I don’t mind answering your questions about that, though.

AllHipHop.com: That’s all good. I didn’t have any plans to dwell on the subject, but I did want to address a few things. You mentioned wanting to change how bad some of the conditions were in the Texas prison systems, how are you efforts going so far?

Pimp C: Some other people in powerful positions have to want to go down there and investigate. It’s common knowledge of what’s going on in Texas, it’s just that the powers that be are so strong down there that the media doesn’t even really want to open up that can of worms. When the time comes somebody will go down there and expose that there are people dying every other day. You’re talking about a system that tells you, “You’re a slave.” I mean, Ray Charles can see that it’s f**ked up and he’s blind and dead! No disrespect to Ray Charles, but do you see what I’m sayin’?

AllHipHop.com: Definitely. You reportedly wrote over 2,500 songs while in prison, with that much material why didn’t you release a solo effort instead of a compilation?

Pimp C: Coming from the type of group that I’m involved with, we’re so serious about our music that we never got to have a good time making music. I’ve never had a fun album in my career; everything was like giving birth to a baby—painstaking and such. I wanted to come out and do something I’ve never got to do.

These are the types of things I was thinking about when I was laying up in that place like, “Why haven’t I gotten to work with these beautiful producers and these guys that make this beautiful Slab Music?” So I finally got to work with them on this project. We always made guest appearances on other people’s projects all through the ‘90s and early ‘00s, but I wanted to make records with some people too. I figured now was a good time to do it, so I did it. Truth be told, I’m not excited about a solo career, I’m in UGK. I don’t even enjoy being onstage without Bun. If I look over to my left, or I look over to my right and he ain’t there, the s**t ain’t right. All of my solo projects or anything that I get involved in is going to have to be something exciting. The day that I make a serious solo album and produce all of the songs myself and really get in there and do that, it’ll be my last album. When you hear that one you’ll know that there will never be another one after that.

AllHipHop.com: Since you opened that topic up, do you ever look forward to the day when you guys focus solely on the artists on UGK Records?

Pimp C: I wanna pull a Dr. Dre and sign a guy or some guys that are serious enough to where I don’t have to actually be in the spotlight; I’d want to nurture there careers to a point where they were important. Of course I would like to evolve into that executive type, but right now I’m still on the front lines. I’ve got some good artists though like Viscous and Smoke D.

AllHipHop.com: Well we just got you back, so we still need another UGK album. Are you guys still signed to Jive as a group?

Pimp C: Yeah, we owe them one more record.

AllHipHop.com: In the past people such as A Tribe Called Quest and Clipse haven’t been happy with their situation at Jive, how about you guys?

Pimp C: I’m not unhappy; things are going good. I’ve been unhappy in the past, but this time around I’m just hoping that everybody does their job. When we bring a project in that we’ve put our blood, sweat and tears into we just want them to step up and do their part—no more, no less. If you’re in promotions, promote. If it’s your job to get the videos played, go get ‘em played. As powerful as they are, they’ve seen acts come and go, so they have an understanding about what needs to be done to get records and videos played.

AllHipHop.com: You were one of the few people to initially support T.I. taking the title “King of the South,” how did that come about?

Pimp C: I don’t think the kid meant no disrespect to anyone by saying that. He meant that he was the king. As black males we have a fixation with things that are royal, like jewels for example, kings wear jewelry. Take the nice cars, for example, the kings had the nicest horses and carriages along with fine fabrics and nice homes. I think the fact that he said “The King,” might have been misinterpreted and I could see how that would offend someone if they were insecure with themselves. What I was saying on his album was that I never got it twisted, I know what he was saying and I support T.I.

I am a little disappointed about what’s going on with him and [Lil’] Flip—in fact I’m more that a little disappointed. I’m not angry, but I’m concerned about how far this s**t has gone. When I see side artists and n***as that don’t even have nothing to do with the beef getting into it and saying s**t it concerns me, I don’t like it. I support all these kids and I want to see them all sell records, but I just don’t think that pouring gasoline on that fire right now is the right thing to be doing. Now I’m not choosing no sides in this s**t, I’m just saying that I’m concerned about the situation, I don’t like it. I like T.I. and I respect him as a man and as an artist, but I don’t like what he and Flip are doing.

AllHipHop.com: You guys have collaborated with just about everyone who is relevant in the South. Did you get the feeling that working with Jay-Z on “Big Pimpin’” was the point were everyone acknowledged that the South was taking over?

Pimp C: He did what nobody else was willing to do, but Jay-Z has always been ahead of the curve. He was the first one, besides Shaquille O’Neal, to talk about platinum. He was the first n***a to come out there with a tennis-bracelet necklace on, he had that s**t on back in 1999. Go back and check “Big Pimpin’” and you’ll see that Jay-Z’s got tennis-bracelet necklaces on in that video. He’s always been ahead of the curve; it’s like he’s got a vision of what’s about to happen. He saw that eventually the torch was gonna get passed to the South—I’m convinced that he saw it. He never told me this, but he’s a very insightful person. He’s witty, observant and he watches what happens in the game. He saw a way to help us and at the same time help himself. You’ve got to understand that a lot of people who would never buy a Jay-Z album bought a Jay-Z album off the strength of that record.

It was great for our careers, and he knew what he was doing. I think he helped influence all this s**t that’s going on with Houston right now. Hats off, nothing but respect goes out to Jay-Z and his organization, as well as the old regime. I worked with all of them back at Roc-A-Fella when that record was going down. I’m cool with both sides - Jay and Dame and everybody and truthfully, I liked it when they was all together. It was something special at The Roc at that time. It’s a good thing to see young blacks getting rich like that together and staying unified.

AllHipHop.com: I’d have to agree with you there. I’ve heard that you were reluctant to do “Big Pimpin’”

Pimp C: Coming from where I come from, our whole fan base is based off of street credibility. Making this kind of music, this beautiful “Slab Music,” as I like to call it, that [song] was not that. It’s not a lot of records before or after “Big Pimpin’” that sound like that, unless somebody tried to go and remake that record. Hearing it finished and watching the video is one thing, but imagine hearing that beat and then rapping on it in the studio after you’ve been rapping hardcore s**t all night. To my ears, it was sabotage and I really didn’t wanna go that route. It only happened after having four or five conversations with Jay and him staying in my ear about it. Our conversations basically went like this:

“Family, this is going to be the biggest record of your career!”

“I know. That’s what I’m afraid of.”

“Come on family, just do it for me.”

“I respect you and it’s your record. If you wanna do it, let’s do it.”

We ended up doing it and we had an indication of what it was going to do in radio. I remember being on the video shoot and him coming up to me saying, “See family, I told you [laughing]. I told you this s**t was gonna be the biggest record,” and I was like, “Yeah, I know. You told me. I was wrong and you were right.” Again, that’s the genius that Shawn Carter has. He’s a fan of this s**t, but he can separate himself and see what’s going to happen ahead of time. He’s not scared to do different types of records and he’s not caught up in one certain sound if it’s the right thing to do. He saw that he had to go get that Timbaland sound and put them country boys from Texas on it—so all credit goes to him.

AllHipHop.com: Since the late ‘90s, a lot of artists have complained about the South’s dominance, but by all accounts you guys are tight with a lot of East Coast artists, including Brand Nubian. How was that experience?

Pimp C: Yeah, they’re friends of ours. As a matter of fact, I was a fan of theirs before I ever met them. We went on a promo tour back in the early ‘90s. Whenever I used to come to New York, I would always stay at Lord Jamar’s house. He used to stay in Brooklyn in the same building as Jay-Z before he came up and moved out of Brooklyn. Those are good guys. Lord J has been instrumental in my career as far as giving me game at the right time and other insights. I look at him and Too $hort as guardians or godfather types in terms of helping me with what I need to do at different times in my career—so that answers that.

Okay man, the bottom line is this: at one time everybody in the East was eating, n***as was eating out West, but nobody was eating down here. If anybody should’ve been mad or bitter it should’ve been us. But now that things have evolved and the game has switched some people are bitter about that, and that’s cool. That’s their opinion, everyone has one, they’re just like assholes. The bottom line is that the s**t we make ain’t even Hip-Hop music. It don’t even have anything to do with the Hip-Hop culture except that it’s Rap. We ain’t got no backpacks, we ain’t never rode on no trains—we got Cadillacs and Gucci briefcases around this motherf**ker. And I’m not bashing nobody, I’m just telling you straight up. I can’t spraypaint worth a motherf**ker, I don’t know a thing about graffiti other than the fact that it looks pretty to me. I don’t even know how to catch the subway, but I know how to drive a Cadillac though. The only things I know about Hip-Hop culture is what I’ve read in books or seen. So, when Kris [KRS-ONE] was saying, “Y’all n***as ain’t real Hip-Hop,” it offended us back then, but he was right. Oh how right was he, so very right. I think the misconception is that we wanted to be Hip-Hop. Maybe some of us did, but at a certain stage if someone keeps telling you that you’re not a part of this and you cannot be this you’ll see. If you keep turning somebody down then eventually they’re going to stop trying. What we did was we created our own thing, our own culture and our own artists. Our sound was what we grew up on, both Hip-Hop and the s**t that they labeled “Gangsta Rap,” [which] to us was just West Coast music.

It may be some people salty that we’re selling records right now, but here’s what we need to do. Let’s put all them n***a’s records on one side of the store and put all the Country Rap s**t on the other side of the store and see who sells the most records. If your records ain’t selling, maybe you’re rapping about the wrong s**t! It’s not their fault, it’s not Mike Jones’ fault your s**t ain’t selling. Don’t be mad at him ‘cause he’s got 14 cars and he just bought the new Ferrari. If you’re really mad, say some names then. Don’t just shoot your little cap out on your mixtape, say somebody’s name if you’re really mad then. What you mad over? Y’all had your time to shine, and truth be told, the ball ain’t gonna stay in the South forever. It’s going to go back to one of the [other] coasts. But, while it’s our time to get it respect that and do you. I think a lot of these n****s wasn’t selling no records at first. If that’s how you feel, then say it and say someone’s name. Just know that every action has an opposite and equal reaction. So, after saying that…whatever, we ain’t trippin’. Just know that we’re listening, we’re buying y’all records. I know about everything that happened from 1979 on up until today. You can ask me about any artist who has come out and I can tell you that I’ve either had the vinyl or I’ve heard it. I bought half of that s**t with my own money so I know my Hip-Hop history. I’m a fan of Hip-Hop music, but what we’re making is a hybrid form of it.

AllHipHop.com: Don’t you think you guys helped redefine what Hip-Hop is though? There are people outside of Texas with Screw Tapes and Grills.

Pimp C: Yeah but gold fronts didn’t originate in Texas. My aunties and s**t from Louisiana have golds in their mouths. People in the South have been wearing gold in their mouths for years. You can gold all the way back to the ‘20s and ‘30s and look at the pimps that had gold in their mouths. People had gold fronts in New York way back in the ‘80s. It’s a misconception. Who can take credit for that? It’s just that it’s being revised right now. Paul Wall put it down and a lot of people were feeling that, he’s got a good thing going and there are a lot of imitators. Some are better than others, but it ain’t going anywhere.

It’s just like Rolex watches. Remember when everybody wanted to wear Rolex watches? Now it’s changed and went to something else, but Rolex ain’t go out of business. They’re still making watches, but it’s just not the fad anymore. Them boys from New Orleans been wearing slugs in their mouth. Now that it’s popular and makes money when you see a grill you relate that to Texas but that’s not necessarily the case. Yeah, we’re doing that but we can’t take full credit for that.

AllHipHop.com: You’ve said that your sound was influenced by The Chronic, among other things. Do you take any credit when you hear people using the 808’s and organs that seem to be influenced by Supertight and Too Hard To Swallow?

Pimp C: No, I was tremendously influenced by the West Coast in my production style. Dr. Dre had a big influence on the way I was trying to organize and put my beats together. If you go back and listen to early N.W.A. records, actually go all the way back to World Class Wreckin’ Cru, but his formula of letting the bass run live all the way through and putting a guitar in is a lot of what we do. They used that 808 for years on the early Eazy-E records and some of the stuff that was happening out in the West. Rodney-O & Joe Cooley also had a big influence on my sound as a producer. Those were the things that I was listening to then. The Chronic was the blueprint and it’s still affecting people now: the way it was mixed, the way he arranged the instrumentation, the way he incorporated samples with live instruments. You have to recognize it as a classic, I see a lot of different ratings that say this, that and the third. What record was bigger than The Chronic? Show me that record! Tell me what record, rhyme for rhyme and beat for beat, was doper than that. Show me that record goddamnit ‘cause I wanna hear that motherfu**er.

AllHipHop.com: Speaking on your production style, how do you adapt from that rough, live feel of “I Left It Wet For You” to today’s crisp, high-tech sound with the newer equipment like the MPC-3000 and Pro-Tools?

Pimp C: When everybody’s studios are ran off of computers of course it changes what I do. What I used to do was a different way of doing things, so I try to keep it as close to what we were doing as possible. Do I like Pro-Tools? I like some things about it, but I feel real nervous knowing my songs are still in some motherf**ker’s computer and I can’t even get my s**t out of there when I leave. That s**t is some bulls**t designed by people that like to steal records. But, as far as editing, it’s a dream when it comes to doing things faster. Do I think that all studios having that computer s**t has cheapened the quality of the music? Of course it has, records don’t sound like they used to bro. There’s too much technology involved and you can hear it. Go listen to some of those old records that we were doing in the studio with SSL boards and a two-inch tape machine. You can hear the difference between that s**t and what these n****s are making right now. The game is popcorn, it’s like comparing something that was cooked in a microwave to something from a gas stove. It might be the same ingredients and even the same recipe, but it don’t taste quite the same in the end. It’s gonna to go back to the real and people are gonna figure it out. It’s all about finding a happy medium between the technology and the old way of doing things. Some will perfect that and some won’t, some just don’t care.

AllHipHop.com: A lot of people from this next generation of Southern artists such as T.I., Mike Jones and Lil’ Flip credit UGK for influencing them. Are you similarly influenced by seeing them take that sound to another level?

Pimp C: Isn’t that the way it’s supposed to work? Wasn’t Run influenced by Grandmaster Caz and them? Weren’t they influenced by them the same way me and Bun were influenced by KRS-ONE, Ice-T and Schooly D? Things just run in cycles and all we’re talking about now is timing. UGK came in the game before them and there were people who came in and influenced us too. The things that are jammin’ at the time when you’re growing up are the things that will influence you when you become a man. They’re just going off of what was jammin’ in the ‘90s.

We just happened to be putting out records that they could relate to at the time. I grew up off of a different set of rappers than Mike Jones and them did. To me Big Daddy Kane and them was some bad motherfu**ers ‘cause them was the n***as I grew up listening to. What if UGK came before the Geto Boys? They inspired us, but that’s one hell of a “What If” right? Timing is a motherfu**er. Them motherfu**ers raised me off of those records. So, yeah it’s nice that people like T.I., Flip, and Killer Mike give it up. That’s what they were listening to in high-school out there running them streets, but it’s all about timing, man. Back when I was in high-school Big Daddy Kane was the coldest motherfu**er I ever heard in my life, next to Run. N***as couldn’t f**k with Run’s style man. That n****s whole persona was the s**t. Of course, I’m talking about the Run from back then, you know what I mean.

AllHipHop.com: It’s ironic that you mention the two different versions of Run, since we all see him doing the family thing now…

Pimp C: Everybody grows, and as you get older you change man. Change is a natural thing that comes with time. You can’t expect for a man to be doing what he was doing 15-20 years ago in 2005. As you get older you want to change for the better don’t you? I would think so. He’s doing what he has to do to feel good about himself and be the best man that he can be. So, yeah I miss the old Run, but when I want to hear it I go back and play that record. If I can remember correctly, I don’t think I’ve ever met Run. I think I saw Run way back, but he was such an intimidating character to me that I was afraid to approach him. I saw him around, what was that album where it looks like they’re walking in the sky?

AllHipHop.com: Tougher Than Leather?

Pimp C: Yeah, I seen him around the Tougher Than Leather time and I was afraid to approach him. It was just so unreal to me.

AllHipHop.com: Now that we see him doing the family thing on Run’s House, I wanted to ask about you, since you’re a family man too. How about the family side of Pimp C that we don’t see? Are you going to PTA meetings and helping out with science projects?

Pimp C: I pick up cleanings, buy clothes, grocery shop, and pick my kids up here and there. I’m not home as much as I’d like to be, but I am home on some family s**t. I go to the car wash and do the things that a father and a husband are supposed to do. I think anything else would be quite ludicrous. All of my kids have a really good understanding of who daddy is out there, who daddy is at home and what daddy does. It’s not always a healthy thing being in the music industry, but I feel you don’t bring your work home and you don’t bring your home [life] to work. That way if one is not doing as well it doesn’t affect the other.